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How has the Senate dispute affected your faith in the electoral process?
Posted at 6:00 AM on June 29, 2009
by Eric Ringham
(19 Comments)
Filed under: Politics/Government
It's been nearly eight months since the election that Minnesotans thought would decide the race between incumbent Norm Coleman and challenger Al Franken. How has the Senate dispute affected your faith in the electoral process?
I will not vote for a 3rd Party again. That is what I have learned. -Virginia, Apple Valley, MN
My trust in the political system has faded away more now because it seems our political parties are out to one up one another rather than to fulfill their responsibilities as working for their state and communities and the peoples interest which has not happened with this last election. -Tim, St. Paul, MN
Comments (19)
My faith in the election process is shaken by the unreliability of absentee voting. The absentee voting process should only be allowed for military and individuals who are out of the country(not out of the state). Our right to vote should be viewed as a great responsibility and not an afterthought. Election days only come every 2 years, plan ahead - be home and take the responsibility seriously.
This is another reminder of 2000 and 2004; our electoral system cannot be trusted
My faith in the electoral process remains where it has been since the "chad" issues that cropped up in the presidential election in 2000: neither high nor low.
I'm mystified as to why we as a society dance around the fundamental issue instead of taking it on directly: We want something different than what we've got. We want a process that is error free and real time, in fact I'd suggest we expect such in this day and age.
At least in my district we count paper ballots. We allow absentee ballots. We have no national identity card requirements, etc. So this is about as manual a process as I guess one could come up with. I'm amazed at how any leading indicators can come out of a process like the one I go through when I vote.
We have modern expectations tragically built on top of antiquated processes with minimal incorporation of technological advancements. It is what it is. As we've discovered, this hasn't been truly "unacceptable" on a mass scale like this until now with this close senate race vote. So when we woke up on November 5th -- still with no clear winner -- we groaned while all the players opened up the rule-books and started in with their specific interpretations as to what the rule book intended in what instances, etc.
I think both the electoral process and playbook need modernization. I think all political parties fundamentally believe this also, but the modernization process itself is fraught with political gaming and interests as well.
My faith is restorable - but only by concerted, sustained effort by all appropriate interests to design a process (including what happens if a result is not clear) that is both modern and objective. That needed cooperation, I fear, is the thing in which I do not have much faith at present.
My heart and mind go out to the people of Minnesota for having had only 50% representation in the Senate since January. It seems almost unconstitutional. In Sarasota County, FL, in 2006, where 18,000 votes went missing and election results were also close and unresolved, the Republican, Vern Buchanan, was seated as Sarasota's rep. right away in Congress while the battle continued. Buchanan ended up keeping the seat and being re-elected, but the outrage is that to this day no one knows what happened to those 18,000 votes.
With laws at the federal, state, county, and other-local levels, our electoral system is quite chaotic. But is there an answer to what should be done about a state with only 50% representation in Congress--denial of rights?
Severina
Minnesota should change its law to allow a special election. That would be MUCH better than the current way in which election officials admitted different counties handled votes differently but said it is ok.
This is a loss for america having a rubber stamp senate.
I've learned that people from Minnesota, Ohio, and Florida have a trouble with counting. It's not quantum physics, it's taking a tally and adding numbers together. Is it really that hard? I knew we were falling behind Asia, but I'm believing more that it's states like these that are skewing the curve.
What a joke ! The only reason this is going on is because a Republican partisan governor refused to sign an election certificate until the court cases are exhausted. Of course they have abused the process as long as they can to keep the lawfully elected Democratic Senator out of office. After a recount, numerous court challenges we still sit in limbo. If this is not incentive for any partisan to challenge election results in Minnesota by abusing the court challenge laws then what would be better? Seriously any challenger with a case as weak as Coleman's would have dropped such a futile challenge ages ago. But due to the ability to keep another Democratic Senator out of office money is poured in by Republicans trying to delay the inevitable result. Its legal and it works. Republicans obviously don't care if its ethical to deny a state their Senator for more than 6 months
My faith in the electoral process is intact, with a hint that the absentee ballot system and rules could use some clarification.
This process has highlighted the power of the judicial system and the potential for it's abuse by those with sufficient wealth.
While it has not disillusioned me to the democratic process, what it has is reaffirmed what I've always said: under any other democracy under than a direct one, there are too many loopholes to even know who the candidates were in the first place. This, along with 2000 and 2004 is further proof that we need to restructure our electoral process in this country, and we need to take from other countries who have mastered the process - dare I say France?
Otherwise, I've learned that the Republican party are guilty of every last bit of hypocrisy (if not more) as their opponents as of late. Coleman told Franken to concede and let it go. Franken didn't and it turned out he won. Coleman fought it, instead of conceding like he told Franken to. Franken won again. Coleman fought it again and lost again. And now Coleman is fighting again, as from all I've been made aware, he's lost again - not officially.
But in the end, I love a good fight between politicians.
It has been, yet another, reason to believe the reference is to money when the "golden rule" is mentioned.
I'm all right with it, sometimes democracy takes a while. Norm Coleman has a constitutional right to do the wrong thing.
If there is any lost faith in politics, it is the fault of the candidates both of whom, in their respective conduct during the election litigation, have used questionable judgment and thus for the electorate make us wonder whether or not either is worthy to hold the U.S. Senate seat.
But, it is not a a lost faith in politics that is at issue. The issue is the manner in which we count.
A quote attributed to Joseph Stalin once said, "Those who cast votes decide nothing. Those who count votes decide everything." At least in the 2008 November election, the electorate will know that the vote they did cast helped their candidate of choice to possibly win the elected office. The more urgent problem involved the much touted but misinformed, misrepresented,and misleading election fad known as Instant Runoff Voting adopted in Minneapolis and contemplated in other cities for municipal elections.
There is much to worry about the counting of elections when, as State Supreme Court Justice Magnuson affirmed recently in a facial constitutional challenge to Minneapolis's IRV scheme that fell short (but did not find IRV constitutional), "[I]t is disconcerting to acknowledge that a voter cannot be sure that his or her vote for a candidate will help, rather than hurt, that canddidate...." In other words, unlike the current system of voting, your choice to help a candidate will not harm that candidate's chance to win. But under IRV, choosing your candidate first may very well harm that candidate's chance to win.
At least in the 2008 November election, each vote cast was equal to the other votes, and thus were effective. Whereas under IRV, the methodology fo counting leads to an ineffective vote that makes a voter wonder whether or not he or she has hurt their candidate of choice, and worse, not knowing where that vote went and if at all counted at the end of the day. Under IRV, in its complex counting methodology -- some votes will be more weighted than others --- an imbalance between voters, that gives some voters a greater chance than others to influence the final outcome of an election.
If people believe that the current U.S. Senate election is unfathomable, wait until the anticipated recount challenges in IRV.
The hallmark of our democracy is embedded in the right to vote -- to have an effective vote, equal to the next voter's vote. Without the right to an effective vote, all other rights are in jeopardy.
The politicians will are not what will bring down the system. It will be the lack of trust and faith in the manner we count votes to ensure the people believe that the winner of an election is truly the winner and not a result of the manipulation of figures in the way we count.
I think Minnesota has a very fair election process and I'm proud of the way the recount was handled. It seems to me that everything was done to assure an accurate recount. Now I think it is time for it to be over. When the Minnesota Supreme court issues it's ruling, an election certificate should be issued and signed by Governor Pawlenty and the winner should be immediately installed to the United States Senate. Minnesota deserves two Senators and the country needs the extra vote to get things done in a timely manner. May the best man wind. Let's get on with the business of the country and get health reform passed this year.
I had faith through the recount. A respectable process done with urgency; it would have revealed any malintent or fraud if it had occurred. It did not find any fraud, it found a close tally and confirmed that it was a statistical tie. Coleman won the first coin toss, Franken won the second.
I am aware every day since Jan 6th that I am underrepresented in the US Senate. A vacancy means no person to express my hopes and concerns to, no person to tell me what is going on in DC, no person to sway colleagues in committee hearings and no person to make votes. Yes Sen Klobuchar is trying to do the work of two Senators, but she is still one person, one perspective, one vote. My constitutional rights are for two people to represent me in the Senate Chamber.
Still, I was patient during the election contest. The judges' panel acted with urgency. I hoped this would end the vacancy.
Today we are 6 months into a vacancy. Coleman has a legal right to this appeal, but his interests, his rights must be balanced against the rights of every Minnesotan to be represented in the US Senate and the decisions that it makes. The rights of >5 million people to representation does exceed Norm Coleman's right to appeal. Guess what, the constitution calls for representation for everyone, not just for the people who voted.
There is a cost to us Minnesotans everyday that the vacancy continues. Even Coleman conceded to the MN Supreme Court that there was no fraud. Coleman has complete power to end the vacancy-- he can concede, but he does not make that choice. Therefore he chooses to extend the vacancy.
Minnesotans have been too tolerant for too long of this complete distortion of our rights in representative democracy. We need to end this delusion that somehow a procedural difference in the election would change the outcome of a statistical tie.
Every day we tolerate this vacancy shakes my faith in our democracy. Right now we're holding Nov 4th, just one day's events, as much more important than the 6 years of representation. In a representative democracy, the point of the election is to get to the relationship of representation.
I'm convinced that the process has been more than fair. I am disappointed over the rhetoric about this being a process to assure that every vote counts. It's clearly been a battle in the Coleman campaign to sway pubic opinion for a lost cause.
For the past 40 years I have never missed an opportunity to cast my vote. This year's election and the resultant Senate dispute have raised doubts for me, especially in the absentee ballot system. There seemed to be many people who took that option this year as a matter of convenience. It was tempting not to wait in the long lines, but to get my vote in early. However, I'm glad now that I cast my vote in person and, in the future, I will continue to do so. In fact, unless the system is changed, I would not waste my time casting an absentee ballot. It seems to me that there are too many issues associated with absentee voting, and too much chance that my vote wouldn't be counted.
Minnesota Political Process - 10
Some Minnesota Politicians - 0
I'm convinced that this process worked the way it was supposed to work. Factors that made this process possible, however, include a vigorous set of efforts BEFORE the election by the current Sec of State to enable a more collegial and functional state-wide coordination between county officials and the State's office, something that had been in disarray under the previous administration. A special mention should also be made of the day-by-day coverage of the entire election and recount process by The UpTake, which enhanced the coverage by standard media outlets (including MPR) with its video documentation of every phase of the recount operation. I found that their coverage contributed enormously to the transparency of the operation because it provided me with visual confirmation of the process when other media were presenting the conflicting claims of lawyers, spin doctors, and various elected officials. MPR also did a superb job of keeping us abreast of the news. I learned a lot about the state's process and its fairness by way of these three sources of information. The upshot is that I am convinced that Minnesota should be proud for providing an example to the nation of how a closely disputed vote should be handled. Now if we could just get the final ruling from the Supreme Court, Amy Klobuchar could catch a break!
I believe the process has worked as it should. Minnesota seems to have a solid process in place. Could it be better? Probably not, it could only get worse if left to more politician involvement.
The election was close. Normally the few ballots which were discussed during this process are not material to the election. But in this situation they came under review.
I would be surprised if any other state could have done this process as well as Minnesota.
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