Judging the Vikings stadium deal (5x8 - 5/11/11)
Posted at 7:10 AM on May 11, 2011
by Bob Collins
(26 Comments)
Filed under: Five by 8
1)THE REVIEWS ARE IN
The Star Tribune hates the idea of a suburb getting the Minnesota Vikings. Didn't a suburb have the Vikings before Minneapolis? In its editorial today, the Strib defends its city...
In return for the more reasonable Minneapolis investment, taxpayers would have a new downtown stadium that would boost the region's most important central business district, and the city would complete the much-needed renovation of Target Center while paying off the arena's debt and reducing property taxes 2 percent in the process.
The Arden Hills math should be a deal-breaker for the state Legislature. In many cases, suburban NFL stadium locations are less expensive than downtown alternatives -- not several hundred million dollars more costly
It may be a fair point. But everyone has known for nearly a decade that the Vikings' lease was up this year at the Metrodome. By waiting until the last minute, the odds grew that whatever stadium deal came out was going to reflect who was in the driver's seat. Mayor R.T. Rybak had plenty of time to put together a proposal for the team, but he went with his two-minute offense and only trotted out his plan a few weeks before the end of a legislative session that's been going since the beginning of the year.
Ramsey County authorities have certainly stuck their necks out there with a plan that soaks people who may have no interest in football. But they stuck them out there, courted the team, made the deal, and now will have to live with the political consequences, if there are any.
Nothing prevented Minneapolis, the Star Tribune's owners (who own property that likely would've been part of a stadium deal) from doing the same thing.
Who knows, maybe they still will. Anoka County thought it once had a deal with the Vikings, only to see the team wooed instead by the bright lights of the big city.
In its editorial today, the Pioneer Press suggests Arden Hills could be playing the sucker's role in a dance with Minneapolis...
We agreed with Bennett and Ortega and the board in February that the county should explore the TCAAP site as a possible location. It is the last large piece of undeveloped land in Ramsey County and it's time the site turned the page. It appears that the Hennepin County board is not willing to raise a tax for a second stadium. That could put the TCAAP site in the spotlight as stadium negotiations and the legislative session approach a climax.
We don't see the harm if the Arden Hills option turns out to have been a bargaining chip to improve the deal in Minneapolis. We are concerned that a "deal" may be dropped in our laps without sufficient time to analyze it. Ramsey County could be an excellent home for the Minnesota Vikings. Such a project could help the region by redeveloping a once-polluted site and improving our highway system.
That's an odd new take on the value of publicly financed football stadiums -- a mechanism to improve highways.
2) THIS IS WHAT FREE SPEECH LOOKS LIKE
Freedom of speech doesn't mean a lot if all it does is protect the popular expression. This is what it looks like near Buffalo, New York, where man objects to a mosque next door. He doesn't object to the religion per se. He objects to its bright lights and the mosque's refusal to put up a six-foot-high fence to screen its property.
"I would really think it's an incitement of hatred against Muslims," a member of the mosque's board said.
"The place is too close. I don't care what people think. It doesn't matter what people think," the homeowner told the Buffalo News. "This is a way to get answers now. I get none from the town. The intent was to catch the eye of the people who I have a problem with."
3) THE GRAND CANYON TOUR
Rocketman Yves Rossy has made his first flight in the U.S., flying over the Grand Canyon strapped to wings and a rocket motor.
4) THE ACHIEVEMENT GAP UP CLOSE
Tim Gihring, a volunteer in a public school in an impoverished Minneapolis neighborhood, couldn't possibly have penned a more depressing commentary on the reality of public schools. Kids don't care. Parents don't care. And people are doing everything they can to pretend the only thing poor students lack is better teachers.
I had other students like him -- boys who wrote poems to fathers who had died of bullets or drugs. They would often want me to write out their work for them, as they recited, since they were terrible at spelling. If I refused, they'd refuse to talk, as though I was being petty. They had nothing; couldn't I, who had everything, do them this one thing?
When I asked them about their future, many would say they wanted to be millionaires, as if that was a career. One asked how much money I made as a journalist and laughed when I told him; he never took me seriously again.
In a sense, the reformers are right: Teachers are often the most important people in these kids' lives -- no one else is helping. But I felt these kids slipping from my grasp one by one, even when they were sitting right in front of me. Stronger forces were pulling us apart: homelessness, depression, in utero setbacks, lack of parents or computers or transportation. Everything that had nothing to do with school had everything to do with school. When we did make progress, when our eyes would meet and we would acknowledge a moment of achievement, it always felt ephemeral, in passing, as though we were glimpsing each other across a great and growing chasm.
It's unlikely you'll see Gihring in ads that've been unveiled to recruit teachers to replace the baby boomer teachers who are expected to retire soon. The Fargo Forum reports the ads are intended to show that one teacher can make a difference.
5) BRUSSEL-SPROUT-SIZE HAIL
Judging by last night's coverage of the storms, my suggestion to use vegetables to characterize the size of hail -- asparagus tips, for example -- has not yet taken root. It's always the same, golfballs and baseballs. Dale Connelly wonders why other sports are left out...
But I wonder - is that our entire athletico-spherical vocabulary? What about handballs? Raquetballs? I've never heard a weather forecaster try to parse relative hardness of hail, though it does vary. If your job is to encourage people to take cover, you would naturally go with the most impressive choice and baseballs and billiard balls are more motivational than tennis balls.
A lacrosse ball is smaller around (7.5 inches) than a baseball (9 inches), could offer a useful distinction, but you never hear meteorologists talk about "lacrosse ball sized hail'. I assume In England and India a handy frame of reference would be "Hail the size of cricket balls." Try that over here and people would be confused. Cricket balls? Aren't they very, very tiny?
The storm chasers, of course, were out...
TODAY'S QUESTION
A survey by Consumer Reports finds that 7.5 million Facebook users are under the network's minimum age of 13. More than 5 million are under age 10. The survey also finds that millions of Americans have been victimized in some way via social networks. Today's Question: What can be done to ensure the safety of young people online?
WHAT WE'RE DOING
This is the last 5x8 of the week. I'm burning up some vacation time tomorrow and Friday.
Meanwhile, we're still in a membership drive so some of this programming has been previously broadcast. The uninterrupted versions can be found online.
Midmorning (9-11 a.m.) - First hour: Excerpts from conversations with three well-known musicians who have also written books.
Second hour: Revisiting Jane Eyre.
Midday (11 a.m. - 1 p.m.) - Both hours: Garrison Keillor, speaking Tuesday night at the annual University of Minnesota Libraries Annual Dinner.
Talk of the Nation (1-3 p.m.) - First hour: Political chatter with NPR's political editor.
Second hour: Trans-racial adoption.
All Things Considered (3-6:30 p.m.) - According to the latest jobs report, the number of people in the U.S. who have been unemployed for more than 27 weeks is still quite high-- 5.8 million. They make up about 43 percent of the country's unemployed. Economists say that it used to be that the long term unemployed were people who could afford to stay out of work without grabbing the first thing offered. But with so many people hit by layoffs, there are lots of people in that boat for reasons beyond their control. Still, there are a few groups that are most likely to be unemployed long term: minorities, older workers, and people with low education levels. Baxter looks at some of the negative implications of long term unemployment for the individual and the broader economy. MPR's Annie Baxter will report.
Pillsbury House Theater mounts a production of "In the Red And Brown Water" at the Guthrie. Actors say the play about a young female athlete caught on Katrina breaks theatrical stereotypes about African Americans. MPR's Euan Kerr will report.
Comments (26)
Somehow, the Ramsey County "deal" with the Vikings has a "Dewey Defeats Truman" feel.
I also wonder about the presumption that a new stadium on the site of the current Metrodome would be a "boost to the central business district." As I recall, the same argument was made in the late 1970's when the decision was made to build the Dome. Certainly, there have been numerous changes to the downtown Minneapolis skyline since then, but the area immediately around the Dome hasn't changed a whole bunch, save for the impact of light rail.
We frequently walk at the Mall of America on weekend mornings before the stores open. On game days, it is easy to tell that a significant number of fans drive to MOA and use it as a staging point for taking light rail to the Dome (or Target Field).
Of course, there are folks who will stay downtown, but many of the fans milling around MOA on game day appear to be families of more modest means.
It's true that the area immediately around the Dome hasn't changed much. But I'm stunned by how much S. Washington Ave has changed in the last 20 years. Not sure that has a lot to do with the Dome, though.
The quote that made me laugh "Cricket balls? Aren't they very, very tiny? "
I think everyone needs to read that twice today:)
The fact that Wilf publicly endorsed the Arden Hills stadium site in partnership with Ramsey County tells me this is a serious deal and not a cat's paw on the Vike's part to try and goad Minneapolis into make a better offer. (Given Hennepin County is out of the picture thanks to Opat's nixing any money from them, that makes is pretty tall order for Rybak to fill, IMO.) So I think the PiPress editorial is a tad too cynical in terms of the motivations involved. I think what's driving this announcement yesterday is the Legislature's timetable. Now the ball is in their court (and the Ramsey County Board's, but I imagine this deal wouldn't have been announced if those ducks weren't already lined up) and the clock is ticking down. Somehow, I can't see the Republicans in the Legislature having the guts to not go along, especially given that Gov. Dayton has been pushing for a deal.
The problem with the Arden Hills deal is that it doesn't add up.
$300 million from the state + $350 million from Ramsey County + $400 million from the Vikings leaves you at least $150 million short on a $1.2 billion project.
And who's responsible for the overruns, which I can guarantee there will be on a polluted site like TCAAP?
I had no idea freedom of speech allows you to make baseless accusations of criminal activity about others. I did not know that the First Amendment allowed me to tell your readers about the meth manufacturing in your basement, Bob. Or the fact that you're involved in a polygamous marriage, not to mention the fact that you make bombs in your basement (right next to your meth lab).
That Buffalo homeowner has every right to put up a sign saying, "I don't like Muslims." I don't think he has a right to accuse specific Muslims of criminal activities of which he has no actual knowledge.
Bob, you would be happy to know that fruits and vegetables are often used to describe size benchmarks for fetus growth. No balls of any kind used in the medical field. I am currently carrying a lemon.
While the guy in Buffalo is certainly demonstrating creative problem solving (if he can be taken at his word), given the current socio-political climate, the wording on his sign could be considered analogous to shouting fire in a crowded theater.
//I had no idea freedom of speech allows you to make baseless accusations of criminal activity about others.
The article explains that. The sign doesn't say which driveway -- to the left or to the right -- it doesn't name a person. And he didn't specify any individual.
Pretty crafty.
Regarding poking fun at an innocent insect's virility:
"The animal kingdom has gained a new record holder after scientists declared a species of cricket to possess the largest known testes of any creature in relation to its body mass.
Delicate measurements of the tuberous bush cricket, Platycleis affinis, showed that its testes accounted for 14% of the insect’s body weight. If the same proportion were applied to a man, his testicles would weigh the equivalent of six bags of sugar each."
How many bags of sugar are YOU carrying, Bob? :-)
http://blog.cytalk.com/2010/11/news-science-reproduction-largest-testicles-of-any-species-that-would-be-the-bush-cricket/
Maybe we could use the fruit analogy to describe the size of insect testicles. Those crickets sound as if they are hauling around some major Jack Fruits. Bob, enjoy your days off.
Thank you for posting #4 (the Achievement Gap). While everyone is distracted with the chattering about the Vikings stadium, I can't help but think that these kids are once again being forgotten. Of course, we are capitalists, and the children don't have money or even vote. It's much easier to blame the teachers than it is to each own up to the fact that we all have a responsibility here; these are our children and our future as a community. Perhaps if we all followed the example set by Tim Gihring and spent some time volunteering in our communities on a regular basis it might help. I am heartbroken to see schools losing desperately needed programs, social workers, and counselors. The inequity in access to healthy food, transit, healthcare, educational and recreational opportuntities is unacceptable. How can a child learn when they are hungry? Don't know where they will sleep that night? Wondering if home will be safe? I know this is simplifying things, but I keep looking around and thinking, "our leaders are busy with Surly and football." How do I explain this political climate to my kids?
@ Christin,
You can tell them because we are a capitalist country where only a few enjoy enjoy picking the rippened fresh fruits right off the vine. These are the few who are IN with the owners of the grove. They get special treatment, therefore get the best fruits.
They will take the best positions of employment, regardless of skill in the field. They will claim they have earned their pay but in the end it boils down to politics.
It's about being an heir to wealth so that you can create buildings that will house your friends as employees.
It's no longer about being knowledgable and well skilled in your field. It is about making the right friends, the right connections.
The impoverished child who wants to be a millionaire but does not want to learn just might become one in this -capitalist- society.
He just needs to work on his manipulation tactics.
There is a large unemployed and talented workforce out there who aren't in the IN crowd.
Success is no longer about how hard you have studied or what you can do or what you know
It's merely who you know.
Bob, so I guess I should have said, "guess which MPR employee with a news blog has a meth lab in his basement, right next to where he and his wives make their homemade bombs?"
Other news stories and interviews with this guy have made it abundantly clear who he's talking about.
, "guess which MPR employee with a news blog has a meth lab in his basement, right next to where he and his wives make their homemade bombs?"
Yeah, though you might want to add, "who isn't responsible for writing the Constitution in the first place," just to nail it down further.
The Constitution's strength is the country's willingness to extend its protections to the most despicable people.
////The Constitution's strength is the country's willingness to extend its protections to the most despicable people.
Or to NOT violate their privacy
Dear Bob and Vivian -
Kudos on protecting the Constitution!
( Is now a bad time to remind you about that ACLU contribution? :-)
"The Constitution's strength is the country's willingness to extend its protections to the most despicable people."
And I too would defend this jerk's right to SAY these things. That doesn't mean he has a right to post a defamatory sign in his yard.
Our positions are very close, but there are curbs on our First Amendment freedoms. That or Clear Channel has been violating the left's First Amendment rights for decades now as they routinely refuse to run billboards they disagree with. Ditto the government entities that restrict what kind of signs you can erect on your property.
I just don't believe the city of Buffalo permits residential property owners to post inflammatory signs meant to disrupt the peace and quiet in their neighborhood. The guy can say whatever he likes, he can put it on his car bumper, but yardsigns can only come out during election season.
@Mark from St Paul
I believe that that SCOTUS had a ruling on yard signs about 3-4 years ago. removed a lot of local laws banning them.
Oh dear Jim,
Thank you for informing me of the ACLU (pledge drive?) to make a contribution.
I happen to stumble upon this:
http://www.aclu.org/blog/free-speech-racial-justice/cop-breaks-kids-arm-and-tasers-him-his-offense-saggy-pants-1
It's these kinds of actions that make me feel so well protected from the possibility of a saggy pantsed offender cuz you know that them boys who were them britches like that are no good.
Is this a violation of freedom of speech?
Oh dear Jim,
Thank you for informing me of the ACLU (pledge drive?) to make a contribution.
I happen to stumble upon this:
http://www.aclu.org/blog/free-speech-racial-justice/cop-breaks-kids-arm-and-tasers-him-his-offense-saggy-pants-1
It's these kinds of actions that make me feel so well protected from the possibility of a saggy pantsed offender cuz you know that them boys who were them britches like that are no good.
Is this a violation of freedom of speech?
Oh dear Jim,
Thank you for informing me of the ACLU (pledge drive?) to make a contribution.
I happen to stumble upon this:
http://www.aclu.org/blog/free-speech-racial-justice/cop-breaks-kids-arm-and-tasers-him-his-offense-saggy-pants-1
It's these kinds of actions that make me feel so well protected from the possibility of a saggy pantsed offender cuz you know that them boys who were them britches like that are no good.
Is this a violation of freedom of speech?
Dear Vivian -
The ACLU pledge drive is ubiquitous.
Kinda like adolescents' questionable taste in dress, and law enforcement officers who take out their frustrations on the weak. :-)
//Kinda like adolescents' questionable taste in dress
I think of it as exercising their freedoms of speech.
Dear Vivian -
"and law enforcement officers who take out their frustrations on the weak" ?
Are they exercising their delusions (which are sometimes re-enforced) of having a state-mandated license to kill? :-)
Say Jim,
///"and law enforcement officers who take out their frustrations on the weak" ?
Are they exercising their delusions (which are sometimes re-enforced) of having a state-mandated license to kill? :-)
Exactly, nothing like some delusional behavior and a six pack of Red Bull and a badge that says you can.
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